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Why do we keep hearing this Horus nonsense?
Yesterday I was "challenged" to view an online video claiming that many aspects of the Jesus story were based on the Egyptian mythological figure of Horus. One of the major hooks was the claim that the mother of Horus, Isis, was a virgin when she gave birth to him.
I took the time to read a bit of Egyptian mythology, and discovered that Isis was not a virgin. The story leaves no doubt about that, because she uses her powers as a goddess to re-animate the body of her husband, Osiris, after he's killed, specifically for the purpose of making love to him. The murder of Osiris (and therefore hereditary enemy of Horus), Set, makes sure she doesn't produce any more offspring that way by chopping up Osiris' body and scattering the pieces. (She gets all of them back except for one--ahem!--crucial part.)
Although the others are harder to look up, I doubt any of the Middle-Eastern or Indo-European gods cited in that video were virgin births, because the fertility religions are all about connecting human sexuality and agricultural production. A virgin birth runs counter to the entire concept.
I'm not saying the maker of the video was necessarily lying. Maybe he learned Egyptian mythology as a 10-year-old, from someone who was too embarrassed to put in the sexual content and substituted the Christian virgin birth story to clean it up.
But this stuff is easy to check, and yet these claims keep coming back here. Why doesn't anyone--especially those who seem so proud of their credentials as skeptics--ever check them out first?
Jessica Rabbit: Very few of the rest hold up under inspection, either. And after a source has been caught in a lie is a lousy time to claim it's otherwise true.
The parallels that do hold up are the "gimmes": son of god, miracle worker, target of murderers, depicted as a child with his mother.
WellTraveledProg: McCabe cites two sources, one late 4th century and one 7th century. Neither describes a pre-Christian form of Horus worship.
Marsyas Weeps: I didn't "fixate" on Harsiesis ("Horus son of Isis"); he is the one claimed to have had a virgin birth. Isis is the alleged virgin.
Marduk's birth is recounted immediately after a mention of his father and his father's lover, evidently Marduk's mother. No virgin birth there, either.
The story of Zoroaster's virgin birth is first found in writings from over eight centuries after Christ, raising serious doubts about who copied whom.
(With a nod to Cassandra): Want to try for Mithras while you're at it? He was either born without any mother a
7 個解答
- 匿名1 十年前最愛解答
"Whatever we make of the original myth, Isis seems to have been originally a virgin (or, perhaps, sexless) goddess, and in the later period of Egyptian religion she was again considered a virgin goddess, demanding very strict abstinence from her devotees. It is at this period, apparently, that the birthday of Horus was annually celebrated, about December 25th, in the temples. As both Macrobius and the Christian writer [of the "Paschal Chronicle"] say, a figure of Horus as a baby was laid in a manger, in a scenic reconstruction of a stable, and a statue of Isis was placed beside it. Horus was, in a sense, the Savior of mankind. He was their avenger against the powers of darkness; he was the light of the world. His birth-festival was a real Christmas before Christ."
-- Joseph McCabe, Catholic priest and author/historian
There is no consensus among historians/Egyptologists about whether Horus was considered to have had a "virgin birth" or not according to Egyptian texts. There is, however, quite a bit of evidence that no matter what the texts say, celebrations surrounding Horus *did* imagine him as having had a virgin birth.
You apparently didn't "check" very well.
Peace.
- 1 十年前
The version you've fixated on seems to be Harsiesis, the Horus of the union of Osiris and Isis, which is not the primary myth.
Horus was celebrated as the child of Isis the God Mother, and was born by the process of parthenogenesis within her. The stories of the wanderings of Isis and her child/children are said to be highly similar to Virgin Mary's wanderings in the Apocrypha. The images of Isis and Horus are remarkably similar to the Virgin and Child symbolism, Horus's birth was celebrated around the end of December, with clearly agrarian references to a stable and manger.
Other ancient creation and virgin birth myths include Marduk (he of 50 names - just a bit Yahweh-like for me), Perseus (although strictly speaking that was Zeus having his wicked way), El and Asharuk(?) (and their 70 spontaneous offspring) - Asharuk being related to the Queen of Heaven references in the Bible and older texts; a bit further afield Krishna was born as Vasudeva after descending into Devaki's womb, which was similar to several other Hindu avatars; Graeco-Roman pantheon Apollo, Theseus, Dionysus, etc. all with varying degrees of intervention.
Then there's the worrying one: Zoroaster, the religion of whom is believed to form the powerful messianic basis for the Judeo-Christian and Islamic traditions, including the prominence of prophets, saints and millennial judgement days. Add to that, one myth that Zoroaster's mother, Dughdova, was a virgin when she conceived Zoroaster by a shaft of light, or that the gods bore Zoraster's seed down the ages to conceive the prophets and messiah.
I'm an atheist not a skeptic.
資料來源： I'd start your research with a litttle bit more rigorous planning but here's a firm link as a starting point: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miraculous_births http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_myth_hypothesis - 1 十年前
Because, Samwise, they are lying to you. They make this stuff up like the Da Vinci Code which the author admits is total fiction. There is another lie out there about Mithras. Now the Mithras cult was a mystery religion. That means its beliefs and practices were a secret. Yet, Christophobes out there continue to claime that they know all about this religion and that that's all Christianity is, is a rehas of Mithraism. There are all these books out there by all these "experts" Don't believe any of it. The Roman Catholic church is your best resource for the real history of Christianity. Protestants have largely lost these sources, but the Catholics know.
- 1 十年前
If you're referring to the fact that most, if not all, of the elements of the Jesus story have been attributed to other god-men who were variously born of a virgin, had a king seek their deaths as a child, born on Dec. 25, etc, hey, that's the way it is. Most of the elements of the Jesus story have their origins in older stories. Religious beliefs shape the form of the myths of the god-men, not the other way around.
- 匿名1 十年前
One similarity down.
347 to go.
- 匿名1 十年前
Satan is always the enemy of the word of God
and he has many followers
- 匿名1 十年前
No publication today beats Bible smut!
Ezekiel 16:37 (NIV) therefore I* (*God, not Satan… so it must be good!) am going to gather all your lovers, with whom you found pleasure, those you loved as well as those you hated* (*this Bible God knows all about your sexual pleasure!). I* (*God, not Satan!) WILL GATHER THEM AGAINST YOU FROM ALL AROUND AND WILL STRIP YOU IN FRONT OF THEM, AND THEY WILL SEE ALL YOUR NAKEDNESS* (*the Bible God is NEVER after any stud, but he can’t resist stripping prude girls naked).
Nahum 3:5-6 (NIV) I am against you," declares the Lord Almighty. "I will lift your skirts over your face. I WILL SHOW THE NATIONS* (*John 3:16?!) YOUR NAKEDNESS and the kingdoms your shame* (*you must be too prude)! I WILL PELT YOU WITH FILTH, I will treat you with contempt and make you a spectacle!* (*the “never changing God” is into some real smutty BDSM stuff for the pleasure of all “enemies”)
This Bible God knows that strip teasing is the best way to catch anybody’s attention! SOME NAUGHTY GIRL FORCED TO PARADE NAKED BEFORE ALL HER WANKING LOVERS AND ADMIRERS. Isn’t that what porno movies are all about? The USA is OFFICIALLY a Nation under this Bible GOD! Hollywood is right on line!
2 Samuel 12:11-12 (NIV) This is what the LORD says (to King David): “Out of your own household I am going to bring calamity upon you. Before your very eyes I will take your WIVES and give THEM* (*plural) to one who is close to you, and HE WILL LIE WITH YOUR WIVES* (*have all kinds of sex with ALL OF THEM) in BROAD DAYLIGHT* (*God supports WIFE SWAPPING and GROUP SEX in full public view in “BROAD DAYLIGHT” without any age restriction! Read all this stuff in your own Bible!). You did it in secret, but I will do this thing in BROAD DAYLIGHT before all Israel.”* (*Christians know this to be “THE IRRESISTABLE WILL OF GOD” to let all of King David’s forfeited wives including QUEEN BATHSHEBA, King Solomon’s mom and one of Jesus’ ancestors have SEX LIVE ON STAGE IN FULL PUBLIC VIEW IN BROAD DAYLIGHT! King David wives’ never had it so enjoyable especially the horny Queen Bathsheba! 2 Sam 16:21-22. Preachers using Heb 13:4 to impose a NEW PURITAN MORALITY need to be investigated!)
Job 31:9-10 (NIV) [“Righteous” Job says to God] "If my heart has been enticed by a woman, or if I have lurked at my neighbor's door, then may MY WIFE grind another man's grain, and may OTHER MEN* (*many men) SLEEP WITH HER* (*have sexual intercourse with her. Fair deal! If Job’s wife is cheating on him, he can always wonder which girl he was fantasizing about had GOD answering his prayer!)
Jeremiah 8:10 (NIV) Therefore I* (*God, not Satan, but GOD) will GIVE THEIR WIVES TO OTHER MEN* (*AGAIN! In the Bible stories any wife with a poorly performing husband was always hopeful that God would give them a new stud for a husband!)
No Christian sex starved lady ought to feel guilty looking around! God not Satan, but God is realizing their erotic dreams with other men. God is no respecter of persons! All this is what some preachers and the Clergy do in their closet until they get caught, if ever!
2 Samuel 12:8 (NIV) I* (*God, not Satan, but GOD) gave your master's house to you* (*King David), and YOUR MASTER'S WIVES* (all of King Saul’s WIVES) into your arms* (*King David was already married to Michal, the daughter of King Saul and now God is adding Michal’s own mom to King David’s collection of WIVES! Can you imagine him having a wild sex party with Michal and her own mom? Still King David confessed that NONE OF THEM TURNED HIM ON like Michal’s own brother Jonathan!
2 Sam 1:26 (NIV) I* (*King David) grieve for you, Jonathan my brother; you were very dear to me. Your love for me was wonderful, MORE WONDERFUL THAN THAT OF WOMEN* (*that’s the kinda love practiced by Ted Haggard the former President Bush’s Religious Adviser)!
King David earned the hand of Michal by fondling the penis of 200 dead Palestinians. According to some popular Preachers, this and all the Bible stories are what the Jewish kids learn in their HISTORY class at school.
1 Samuel 18:27 (NIV) David and his men went out and killed two hundred Philistines* (*early Palestinians). He brought their foreskins and presented the FULL NUMBER* (*!) to the king* (*at that time David was a plain shepherd running a band of hoodlums! He was not cheating, though. He counted the foreskins of the dead Palestinian penises several times over to make sure he had 200!) so that he might become the king's son-in-law. Then Saul gave him his daughter Michal in marriage.
Can you imagine the kinky ROYAL wedding reception they had? Especially for the BRIDE to know that her loving husband the future King David of Israel remove the penis head wrapping skin of 200 dead Palestinians to marry her!?
